Hit some big epiphanies today - making a shift
Today my mind was racing all day, stuff was flooding up without me even really thinking. Things like, how did I make it this far in life without knowing how to spell epiphanies? Even autocorrect couldnt save me.
Other than that I would really like manwhores input here, motherfucker probably knows a lot more about what happened to me than I do lol. What did you do to me MW?!
Okay, brief history of me. I was raised in a VERY strict religious household. I was raised by mom and the church.
When I was 16 or so I started to have the tendecy to question what I was taught, I was always open minded. I started to question a lot of things and the beliefs that were instilled in me. It started very small at first but by the time I was 19 I was ready to kill myself. I just listened to Jeffys newest video about absurdness. Really struck a cord with me, I was faced with the same fucked up realizations that he faced when he was 15. Everything came down and I had no clue how to rebuild my reality, where I was going to end up, who was going to help me. I resisted that change SO much because I was so lost. It even got to the point where I was conciously looking for any little bit of logic/reasoning/thought process that would allow me to keep my reality in tact. Not only would it mean harsh things about my past but I had more fear about the future and always massive massive What If's.
Well I was about to take my life. I was completely calm about this idea I had before. As I sat on the floor of the bathroom stall, completely sure I was ready to do this... A thought popped into my head of what would happen immediately after. I was ok with the thoughts of my parents finding out and such but that seemed easier than them finding out I didn't want to be who they raised me as anymore. But the only thought that stopped me was thinking of the first person to find me. Maybe my good friend and coworker. Maybe a random employee. Fuck that would ruin their day.. And then 911 will be called and that would cause a fuss. And what of the poor bastard who has to mop up this floor. I sat there and become real present and from a grounded place said "fuck it," tried to make it look like I wasn't crying and headed back to work.
That was like three years ago now and I just feel like Im emerging from that tipping point.
It took a lonnggg time to rebuild my reality. It was shakey as fuck for a long time. There were times where I was growing like crazy, just killing it.. and there were times where I would break down cryinig for no reason, thoughts of reverting back, exploring escapism, thoughts of suicide again.
I really feel like the past 6 months or so I've been making MAJOR leaps.
About a year ago I was out of my former belief system mentally. This took A LOT of reading, learning, socializing with people not from my upbringing (this was sometimes hard cause I still had to maintain my rep, so it involved a lot of forums, association of shit like RSD videos but also books and videos about science, the world, history, comedy, etc.) and a shit load of other work. Finally I had the foundations mentally to make the shift into a new reality.
But my lifestyle, emotions, decisions were all still fucked up. I was still not living the life I wanted. Well shit. Last summer I started to make moves and take MASSIVE action towards that life, Even though I was loosening other peoples hold on my life, they still had a lot of influence.. maybe not over my actions.. in private ;) but over my emotions and habits for sure. I knew I needed out from the city I was raised in. So I moved out. I didn't know then that remembering where you came from is cool and where you live doesn't matter. I was fairly independent before and did shit like travel the world but I was in no way shape or form able to just enter into mainstream society and move out on my own. I thought I was. Wasn't lol.
It wasn't the fact I didn't know how to live on my own, it was the fact I didn't know what the point was.
I started to get overwhelmed by certain things and had trouble managing my time, finances, as well as knowing to do other simple proactive shit.
But that along with several other leaps into the unknown helped me remove myself from influences I didn't want to have and more towards things I do want. I started to make concrete goals and pull the saftey nets away. And when I was slammed with failure over and over again, the pain of the circumstances it put me in, and the pain of failing gave me more motivation to take action. Around this time me and manwhore teamed up for coaching, Even then I didn't have any strong goals I wanted him to help me accomplish, I didn't even think my current reality was possible then lol. I basically just wanted to become more charismatic and become more of a better man with no real know how of how to do it.
This is what I am saying when I dont even know what the fuck he did because I was such a bad student haha. Like I had no concrete goals, didn't really know up from down in my reality. I just knew doing coaching with manwhore would help but didn't really have the know how to really make big changes. But I did have HUGE drive.
Well. A few months later and I feel my emotions have finally shifted. The thoughts of the new reality were changed and now my emotions are in line with that. I no longer feel guilt when I be who I want to be. I used to feel a shit ton of guilt. I would push the limits but the guilt was always just in front of where I wanted to be, Now the guilt feelings match my thoughts and guilt is no where to be seen.. At least not with the stuff Im into. But shit like this. It affected ALL areas of my life,.
That stuff I posted about and talked on teleconference #2 all happened on a low cycle. I got REALLY down on myself and was fucking up left right and centre. I was taking action but my priorities were fucked up and my positivity and emotions hit a low. I felt my reality again being smashed, If I was going to have this new reality I was really going to have to go for it. No half stepping or Im going to fuck myself AGAIN.
I reached out to manwhore during a lull and he told me very VERY simply what I needed to hear. I was pretty lost and all sorts of fucked up about a few things but he would simply tell me what I needed to do which once was literally "do what you want." He finally figured out I had the capacity to succeed, just I wasn't truly a MAN. He helped me with my coming of age story. I was pushing myself into the wild for a LONG time before manwhore but he was a HUGE influence and guide for sure.
Well I listened, took some action and just these past two weeks things have changed a bunch. I am SO much more grounded, focused and in congruence with myself now than I have been in years, Probably a few years until I was this grounded. Even before then until the last time I felt I had strong purpose in life, a firm reality.
Fuck. I am happy to get this out, all day I was having epiphanies and thoughts of gratitude. I feel like a pokeman evolving, or like I've been neo for a bit but finally realized I'm the one. Its the feeling you get when you finally feel in control of your reality.
I really hope this helps one of you guys reading this. Whether you have made this shift, are looking to or if youve always felt grounded at least maybe its a glimpse into the reality of loads of guys in the community. I really feel like this relates to ANYONE trying to make changes, just circumstances are different. If this doesn't help anyone I am just happy to have a place where I can flesh out these ideas. I was so excitied to get home today and write this out before I forgot things,. which I probably did, my mind was buzzing today, If anything just to document this. Please please PLEASE ask questions about my situation or your relation to my story, It would really help draw things out in my mind and force me to remember the lessons here.
Thanks manwhore for your help and this forum for catalysting this shit.
Very cool. This is an example of the game being a tremendous catalyst for improving peoples lives. At the end of the day, its not even about sex and women, that's just a bonus. Its really about the comraderie and self help portion. I'm really glad you wrote this and are actively pursuing what you want in life. Keep it up dawg
Thank you for writing this up. I'll have more to add after I think on it.
Really interesting to get a glimpse into this.
Were any of you abused at all as kids?
Do any of you see how "Coming of Age" rituals solved this issue back in the day?
I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student
- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)
- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male
I wasn't really abused, but I was bullied by kids my age and babied by adults (which in many ways was FAR more damaging than the actual bullying).
I remember thinking that the bullying itself really wasn't that bad and that I could deal with it. But then society/adults basically projected onto me that I was a victim and I followed suit/identified with it cuz.... what did I know and then that shit snowballed
Pretty crazy how something so dumb can literally become the foundation that your personality gets built upon and then you have to spend years digging yourself out of it
Edit: I was also raised hardcore catholic, although it sounds like I didn't have it as bad as icewahine. Only other thing that was pretty bad was that because I was so babied and socially isolated, I spent years at a time playing WOW all day, everyday. That was pretty much all I did in high school. How my parents thought that was a better idea than telling me to practice safe sex is beyond me. The internet, and online gaming especially, can be a really nasty place filled with really negative people. Over the years that negativity just compounded into me. Plus, since I wasn't allowed to go out at all or do anything, I pretty much had to come up with every limiting belief in the world to rationalize my inaction when it came to chicks. Thing is, I actually wanted to hit on them, learn game and stuff, but I knew that if my parents found out they would be super pissed and would just yell at/punish me so it seemed pretty pointless. The lack of action/freedom/living in alignment with my values+constant negativity drove me headfirst into depression.
That was pretty much my upbringing. Then I went to college, thinking it would be different, but after my freshmen year realized nothing had changed so I found RSD/MW and here I am.
Yes that was the point I was making actually. Being babied is TERRIBLE for guys lol. We have to laugh 'cuz it's so emasculating and disgusting.
You're right about the bullying. It gave you a level of clarity over yourself vs society that was invaluable.
But yes the years of WOW and being embedded in such negativity was also super destructive.
I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student
- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)
- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male
Yup, thank god for you, Tolle and RSD or I would pretty much be permanently fucked
This video seemed appropriate to this thread
Ok. This is cool.
Until very recently I was in complete denial about my early years. But man oh man MW, do I have a LONG history of abondoment and self abuse....geezus. It is sort of coming to a head right now and I feel like I am at this point where I move through this "Coming of Age" period or just stay stuck which just means more pain. I am seeing more and more just how problematic emotions are. They are like bricks weighing down a ferrari.
For me, I was raised in a Christian family, but GUILT was the biggest thing I was taught. The guilt that my mom would give me dad for not "going to church" or taking the kids to sunday school was instilled in me at an EARLY age. I rarely went to church and to be honest, the whole religion thing was never discussed. But the physic energy of my mother was just as effective. She would just think think think think worry worry worry then blow up....like clockwork. I mean its hard to say how often I remember as I kid this happening....conditioning!!! She would never admit it, but goddamn, Jesus christ is the only way!!!!
I am facing up to this ego that I constructed over the years to make me "perfect." A "perfect" kid who never lies, steals, or cheats. And since this impossible to live by, I just beat the shit out of myself emotionally...still an attempt to be perfect. AND its pretty clear how that ego was contstructed.
Babied yes. Neglected yes. Abused physically not at all, but emotionally, shit man, where was the love!!! But I am sure we all have our war stories to share. It is just a bit fucking crazy to look back at ALL the fucking drama that happened, I mean seriously? Over church? Or was it just that two people who married each other out of emotional clinginess had grown to hate each other and were too afriad to own up to anything. Am I still a bit pissed? Yes, and this is an emotional barrier that I must break through.
So our conditioning runs pretty damn deep.
For me its like a freaking saw at the moment, Im a bit up, Im a bit down, Im a bit up, Im a bit down....But hearing this def. makes me want to get back to work with MW who showed me what it is like to feel like a complete pimp even while tripping out for a couple months.
Jesus, I could write or hours about this shit, but i just deleted it, and I'll try to make this concise. Basically neglect/emotional abuse leave you questioning EVERTHING you do, and doublethinking your relationship with parents and other people, trying to control, being passive - aggressive, not leading, no natural healthy dominance , hell not even natural submission when appropriate. I refer to my years before college as a fog, because I had no true motives, no congruent interests, and no real interests or even a real personality. So when you mention suicide icewahine, it sparked something and I thought why would I kill myself, since I was basically brought up to be dead person.
From my reading and exploring these subjects, this is also a byproduct of agriculture since before you used to have a shitload of parents, everybody in the tribe/group shared child care and slimy egoic behaviours were easily eradicated and given no ground to grow. People were taught the universe/nature created them and not the two chodey parents who have to constantly validate their shitty beliefs by dumping that shit on the child, cause due to the beliefs shallowness they need others to believe in them and mirror it.
Also , icewahine, when you moved out , did you go no contact or? Moving out is the next step for me, and I'm pretty unclear about the whole communication after thing.
Dude this is a really awesome post, and I have tons of respect towards you for sharing your suicidal thoughts. I find it great than you can write about it, as if it was a past lifetime.
It's interesting to read about those of you that were sheltered by parents and religion throughout your childhood. Personally, I was raised with a crazy amount of freedom. I never attended church, and my parents pretty much said that my relationship with god was personal thing that I should decide on. This was powerful. I actually remember one night when i was a little boy I had a revelation that my conciousness would last forever, straght up eckhart tolle shit. I knew that wether we go to heaven, or we get reincarnated, or we go somewhere else... the observer will always be alive and well. This idea wasn't put into my head by anyone, it came to me. I am so grateful to be brought up with such spiritual freedom.
Really interesting to get a glimpse into this.Were any of you abused at all as kids?
Do any of you see how "Coming of Age" rituals solved this issue back in the day?
emotionally yes. physically.. i think so but it stopped when i was still fairly young so i dont really remember. i do have very fuzzy memories of being physically abused i just dont know to what extent
and yeah i sort of.. but i dont think i see the full implications of that.
btw thanks for your input guys! its really great to hear similar experiences from like minded guys
This video seemed appropriate to this threadhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Az3u-YcBndE
Ive seen this before but watching it again now. i relate to this sooo much. haha down to the point where ive literally spent hours laying depressed in a snow bank just like tyler. i am having the exact same transition he talks about like right now, today in fact.
actually even just replying to mw about abuse, makes me realize something ive been resisting forever. i was abused as a child. fuck. its weird to type that to be honest, but now i wikipedia'd child abuse and the first 20 years of my life were plauged by the direct problems child abuse creates. well fuck haha, its impowering to see. going through the process of game, or anything (career, fitness, working toward any goal) forces you to face reality over and over. its made me fail and by failing ive been forced to face my own weaknesses, over and over. once you face them you can just move past them and carry on.
coming of age rituals tell the young man that he can overcome his weaknesses? or give him the confidence to do so?
I think seperating myself from the church got me out of the sheep like mindset. from there i was able to learn more about the world and myself; now im in the right position to act on what i know.
fuck guys a lot of shit is clicking in my head. I need to record everything that is bouncing around up there lol, if i lose these lessons ill cry
We'll talk about Coming of Age rituals in the next call and this as well.
I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student
- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)
- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male
Babied yes. Neglected yes. Abused physically not at all, but emotionally, shit man, where was the love!!! But I am sure we all have our war stories to share. It is just a bit fucking crazy to look back at ALL the fucking drama that happened, I mean seriously? Over church? Or was it just that two people who married each other out of emotional clinginess had grown to hate each other and were too afriad to own up to anything. Am I still a bit pissed? Yes, and this is an emotional barrier that I must break through.So our conditioning runs pretty damn deep.
One thing that is REAL important to remember is to really truly forgive whoever "hurt" you. Just learned that. I mean just like you were helpless as a kid, your parents, friends, teachers, mentors, preist, or whoever. I mean I saw an old mentor in my life. From my early years not too long ago. I had to go see them to drop something off and spent a few minutes with them. To hate on them for anything is a waste of brain power and pretty silly since they are likely just has scared as you were and just didn't have the strength or resources to push through.
I think of how far I have come and A LOT of that is due to sheer luck/circumstances. The other factor is working like a mother fucker
Dude this is a really awesome post, and I have tons of respect towards you for sharing your suicidal thoughts. I find it great than you can write about it, as if it was a past lifetime.It's interesting to read about those of you that were sheltered by parents and religion throughout your childhood. Personally, I was raised with a crazy amount of freedom. I never attended church, and my parents pretty much said that my relationship with god was personal thing that I should decide on. This was powerful. I actually remember one night when i was a little boy I had a revelation that my conciousness would last forever, straght up eckhart tolle shit. I knew that wether we go to heaven, or we get reincarnated, or we go somewhere else... the observer will always be alive and well. This idea wasn't put into my head by anyone, it came to me. I am so grateful to be brought up with such spiritual freedom.
That is amazing, I am straight up jealous lol. That is so damn cool. I had thoughts like that when I was kid when I would look up at the stars. Just I had stupid beliefs imposed on me which changed the meaning of that feeling. But its cool you say that because I one hunderd percent still believe in god, or whatever you want to call it. Actually its really interesting, as a kid I saw people poke jokes about god being a bearded man.. I always thought it was silly to personify god like that. Whatever higher intelligence is out there it is NOT anything like us in any way. We can just channel its power sometimes. Crazy to think about.
Your post also reminded me of what it was like to grow up without certain freedoms.. but then I think back to where I DID have freedoms and I either KILLED it or messed up but almost always if my beliefs lined up with a goal and I was given freedom I would CRUSH whatever was out in front of me or at least take massive action on it and learn from failure
Also , icewahine, when you moved out , did you go no contact or? Moving out is the next step for me, and I'm pretty unclear about the whole communication after thing.
Thats sweet about the agricultue thing. Wow really enlightening actually, so many implications.
It COMPLETELY depends on your situation.
When I moved away it might as well been running away. That was not smart lol. I think moving out is really REALLY good for lots of young guys if they need more freedom to grow but moving out just to get away is pretty lame. Take POSITIVE action, so I don't know what you situation is like but I don't really feel I have the ability to answer that for you.