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Joined: 07/21/2014

Hey guys,



I met a HB at a bar on a night out with friends, she was their friend as well (social circle game! :p) and we hit it off immediately. We talked about everything and she talked a lot about her ex who she hadn't seen for at least three months but isn't able to get over because they've got a long history (2 or 3 years) together and their parents know each other, even though he's 2 years younger than her. So we had a good night, went to grab a bite to eat, my friends leave to go home and I end up walking her, her sister and her friend back to their place. She invites me in, we chill on the sofa watching a movie with her friend there, then her friend goes upstairs to sleep. She kept saying how tired she was and for me to excuse her if she fell asleep, and in the conversation mentioned that she only wanted friends now. She said she used to get over he ex every time they broke up by getting with other guys but used to wake up feeling empty and sad, and didn't want to do that anymore and wanted to get over him properly and completely now. So like a chode, after a bit I excused myself and left :/

I hit her up a couple of days later and arranged a chill night date which we went on and enjoyed each other's company, and I increased my kino a bit more (no makeout though). She mentioned that we don't feel any awkwardsness between us if we didn't have anything to say and just sat there and enjoyed ourselves. Walked her home at the end of the night (like 3am or so), went in and lay on the sofa, her friend from last time came down because she couldn't go to sleep, and they both sat on the opposite sofa (since I took up all the space on my one :/). I helped myself to watch TV then a bit of banter here and there then her friend got up and I sat next to her on her sofa and casually moved my fingers around her leg whilst all three of us bantered. Then she went up to her room to take off her makeup which was annoying her now and change into her pyjamas. I continued bantering with her friend a bit, then asked where's the water, went poured a cup for myself from the kitchen then (retrospectively it might have been creepy) went up to where her room was and knocked on her door. She had already taken off her makeup and put on her pyjamas. She opened up the door and I told her I still haven't had a tour of her room. She let me in, I looked around a bit, then as I got a bit close to her she backed away and went downstairs to her friend, only to return together now :p A bit of give and take blah blah blah then yours truly chodes out again and leaves.

A few days later I text her and we start talking a bit, banter here and there then she suddenly doesn't reply to my text (I asked her if she knows a certain person that I knew). 5 days later, I text her again with " Hey croissantbutt, what have you dug your paws into lately?" and she doesn't reply again (butt joke because we talked about her butt's shape on the date). It's been 5 days since the last text.



What should I do now?



Call? Text? A friend showed me the following post on Manwhore's Forum, should I use the text message in it?: http://manwhore.org/forum/content/when-you-tease-too-hard


Your help would be really appreciated guys :)

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Joined: 01/18/2012
This is a typical "chode goes

This is a typical "chode goes on date" and wonders why it doesn't work out. You didn't even kiss her? You've got NO sexual chemistry dude. You can't go on this flimsy "no balls" dates and think something good is going to come of it. Plus she's telling you that when she had a problem with her boyfriend she'd go and fuck some other dude? But you just sit there and listen to it and then leave. It's pathetic dude. You're not going to get laid operating in this headspace and behavior set. You need drastic revamping. Plus you can't let a girl trip balls over an ex-boyfriend because it's undermining YOUR prerogative here which is to fuck her. Which tells me you've got zero conversational steering abilities. All in all it's just a complete lack of game and a complete lack of understanding of how women and dating and seduction actually works. 

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Joined: 07/21/2014
I couldn't agree more. Is

I couldn't agree more.
Is there anything I can do to reverse any damage that I've made here and get back on track with this girl? I know I've screwed up big time, and I am ready to do ANYTHING and give it ALL it takes to make this right again, for now and for always.

Dfusion's picture
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Joined: 01/07/2015
Dang bro you really did fuck

Dang bro you really did fuck this one up. You can still go for the Hail Mary but I think you need to step back for more than a week, let things cool down, have her forget some of your incompetance. After at least 2-3 weeks goes by, you have to carefully plan your A game so you can man up, impress her, and lock it in. It sounds like going back to her place is bad idea. Too many interuptions from friends and at this point a reminder that you aren't gonna do shit anyway. Plan something cool, fun, something with an edge of adventure to it. Get her excited and having fun. You can grab food afterwards but no matter what leave her friends out of it. Keep it just you two and know ahead of time where you're gonna take her after so there is no chance of things going downhill.

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Joined: 06/04/2012
Classic case of poor sub

Classic case of poor sub comms. If a girl is talking about an ex nonstop in front of yu there is definitely something wrong.

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Joined: 01/18/2012
Dfusion wrote: Dang bro you

Dfusion wrote:
Dang bro you really did fuck this one up. You can still go for the Hail Mary but I think you need to step back for more than a week, let things cool down, have her forget some of your incompetance. After at least 2-3 weeks goes by, you have to carefully plan your A game so you can man up, impress her, and lock it in. It sounds like going back to her place is bad idea. Too many interuptions from friends and at this point a reminder that you aren't gonna do shit anyway. Plan something cool, fun, something with an edge of adventure to it. Get her excited and having fun. You can grab food afterwards but no matter what leave her friends out of it. Keep it just you two and know ahead of time where you're gonna take her after so there is no chance of things going downhill.

Nailed it. 

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I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student

- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)

- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male

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Joined: 07/21/2014
I know bro, it was an epic

I know bro, it was an epic fuck up. The thing is she banters a lot and is proper on sexual innuendos, so I never get when she's just bantering and when she's being serious, many mixed signals. One time she'd be like "I'm going to post this pic for my ex to see and if he asks where I am I'll say oh just on a date with a guy I want to fuck" or would randomly say something like "tonight is going to be good", and other times she'd be like "I JUST want friends right now, nothing else" or moving away when I try to escalate...It was my first time doing social circle game and day 2s, I had no idea when and how to escalate or what to do so I just improvised.

Thank you for your great advice dude! Sounds maybe like the best thing to do. I live with my parents so I've got to figure out a place where it'll be just us two when I try to go for the pull. Any suggestions?
And what would be the best way to re-engage the conversation with her again?

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Joined: 07/21/2014
About the sub comms and if a

About the sub comms and if a girl talks about her ex in front of me, should I tactically change the subject to something else and every time she tries to go back to it, stop her, or what would be the best approach? I've never had a girl talk to me about her ex.

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Tap Water wrote: About the

Tap Water wrote:
About the sub comms and if a girl talks about her ex in front of me, should I tactically change the subject to something else and every time she tries to go back to it, stop her, or what would be the best approach? I've never had a girl talk to me about her ex.

Manwhore can tell you best, but what I would do is every time she mentioned the ex, don't say anything. Literally, go quiet, don't make eye contact with her, act a bit irritated like you could could really give a shit less. If you comment back to her whenever she says something, you're just enabling her to keep saying more. If you go quiet, she'll get the idea, but you need to follow up with something that gets her mind focused on you. Do things that resonate significance. Make her remember your presence when you're with her and that will get her mind off the ex. If that's not happening, you're not doing enough. Imagine if it was situation reversed and a chick was hanging out with you and you kept bringing up the ex. If she went quiet on you and looked like she was about ready to leave every time you said something, you would get the hint.

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Manwhore wrote: This is a

Manwhore wrote:
This is a typical "chode goes on date" and wonders why it doesn't work out. You didn't even kiss her? You've got NO sexual chemistry dude. You can't go on this flimsy "no balls" dates and think something good is going to come of it. Plus she's telling you that when she had a problem with her boyfriend she'd go and fuck some other dude? But you just sit there and listen to it and then leave. It's pathetic dude. You're not going to get laid operating in this headspace and behavior set. You need drastic revamping. Plus you can't let a girl trip balls over an ex-boyfriend because it's undermining YOUR prerogative here which is to fuck her. Which tells me you've got zero conversational steering abilities. All in all it's just a complete lack of game and a complete lack of understanding of how women and dating and seduction actually works. 

gawd damnnnnn that was hawt. 

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Ps. MW this reminds me of our

Ps. MW this reminds me of our very first coaching session together. Like almost 2 years ago. 

I met up with this total hottie off tinder. And literally kissed on the cheek, whiskey her on her way at the end of the night and thought I killed it. Then we looked at the story and you tore me apart at how bad she was down for sex and it flew right over my head. 

At one point she was like 

her: I'm so glad I don't have to work tomorrow 

me: Yeah no kidding, I love sleeping in 

Then I continued to drive her to her bus stop so she could go home ! 

Though taht was also when I had boner anxiety so i probably dilerbatley tried to pretend girls dind't want sex right away. 

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Don't meant to fuck the OP's

Don't meant to fuck the OP's mood up! But when you fuck it up the first time this bad, it's hard to get a second chance. 

Because, honestly, it's hard for them to imagine you breaking out of chump territory. 

They feel like with you, they'll fall right into a boring gay relationship. 

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Which is precisley what

Which is precisley what happened with the girl who I totally failed to man up to. I messed up the first night and never was able to get another chance. Even though everything went pretty well, except for my lack of balls. 

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Joined: 01/18/2012
Oh my GAWD I remember this!

Oh my GAWD I remember this! LOL! Dude I was so concerned for you when I read that! I was like.. wow ok homey is a bit less further along than I may have previously imagined. LOL. 

Look at you now though holy crap. You're a fucking monster. Geezez

patrick.bateman wrote:
Ps. MW this reminds me of our very first coaching session together. Like almost 2 years ago. 

I met up with this total hottie off tinder. And literally kissed on the cheek, whiskey her on her way at the end of the night and thought I killed it. Then we looked at the story and you tore me apart at how bad she was down for sex and it flew right over my head. 

At one point she was like 

her: I'm so glad I don't have to work tomorrow 

me: Yeah no kidding, I love sleeping in 

Then I continued to drive her to her bus stop so she could go home ! 

Though taht was also when I had boner anxiety so i probably dilerbatley tried to pretend girls dind't want sex right away. 

__________________

I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student

- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)

- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male

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Yeah most of us would be

Yeah most of us would be like.. well that went balls up! And we'd walk away from it. But scarcity forces a guy to pursue these situations which invariably ends up reinforcing the same bad behaviors in the first place because it causes them to chase something that isn't there, lol.

Holmes you got to work on your timidity issues. In speech/communication as well as the moves you make. Be more of a boss, lead things, sound like a boss. 

__________________

I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student

- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)

- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male

Tap Or Click For Personal Coaching Information

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Joined: 07/21/2014
Dfusion wrote:Tap Water

Dfusion wrote:
Tap Water wrote:
About the sub comms and if a girl talks about her ex in front of me, should I tactically change the subject to something else and every time she tries to go back to it, stop her, or what would be the best approach? I've never had a girl talk to me about her ex.

Manwhore can tell you best, but what I would do is every time she mentioned the ex, don't say anything. Literally, go quiet, don't make eye contact with her, act a bit irritated like you could could really give a shit less. If you comment back to her whenever she says something, you're just enabling her to keep saying more. If you go quiet, she'll get the idea, but you need to follow up with something that gets her mind focused on you. Do things that resonate significance. Make her remember your presence when you're with her and that will get her mind off the ex. If that's not happening, you're not doing enough. Imagine if it was situation reversed and a chick was hanging out with you and you kept bringing up the ex. If she went quiet on you and looked like she was about ready to leave every time you said something, you would get the hint.

This is awesome advice Dfusion, it covers several areas that I need to improve and puts a lot of things into perspective, I will consciously put every single bit of it into action, thank you man :) What's the best message/type of message to send her do you think? She has a dance performance on the 15th of February that she's been rehearsing for, shall I use that or no?

And also shall I use a boyfriend destroyer if she talks about her boyfriend again (especially negatively)?

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patrick.bateman wrote: Ps. MW

patrick.bateman wrote:
Ps. MW this reminds me of our very first coaching session together. Like almost 2 years ago. 

I met up with this total hottie off tinder. And literally kissed on the cheek, whiskey her on her way at the end of the night and thought I killed it. Then we looked at the story and you tore me apart at how bad she was down for sex and it flew right over my head. 

At one point she was like 

her: I'm so glad I don't have to work tomorrow 

me: Yeah no kidding, I love sleeping in 

Then I continued to drive her to her bus stop so she could go home ! 

Though taht was also when I had boner anxiety so i probably dilerbatley tried to pretend girls dind't want sex right away. 

That story reminded me of one time I met this girl a couple of years ago at a university revision lecture during exam times and we were discussing the module we were studying, then she asked if I'd like to revise with her and I was like no like studying alone! I know... complete chode :p

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Manwhore wrote: Yeah most of

Manwhore wrote:
Yeah most of us would be like.. well that went balls up! And we'd walk away from it. But scarcity forces a guy to pursue these situations which invariably ends up reinforcing the same bad behaviors in the first place because it causes them to chase something that isn't there, lol.

Holmes you got to work on your timidity issues. In speech/communication as well as the moves you make. Be more of a boss, lead things, sound like a boss. 

I'm now working on my timidity issues, and I'm trying to be non-apologetic about any ballzy actions I take. I like the speech/communication thing and being more of a boss in everything I do - will definitely make those second nature. I would really find it useful if I also knew the signs which signal that I am pushing it too much and need to cool off a bit.

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Dfusion wrote: Tap Water

Dfusion wrote:
Tap Water wrote:
About the sub comms and if a girl talks about her ex in front of me, should I tactically change the subject to something else and every time she tries to go back to it, stop her, or what would be the best approach? I've never had a girl talk to me about her ex.

Manwhore can tell you best, but what I would do is every time she mentioned the ex, don't say anything. Literally, go quiet, don't make eye contact with her, act a bit irritated like you could could really give a shit less. If you comment back to her whenever she says something, you're just enabling her to keep saying more. If you go quiet, she'll get the idea, but you need to follow up with something that gets her mind focused on you. Do things that resonate significance. Make her remember your presence when you're with her and that will get her mind off the ex. If that's not happening, you're not doing enough. Imagine if it was situation reversed and a chick was hanging out with you and you kept bringing up the ex. If she went quiet on you and looked like she was about ready to leave every time you said something, you would get the hint.

The problem here is remember you're dealing with a timid guy. So when you tell him to go quiet and not make eye contact wit her, how do you think that's going to go? Lol. It takes a pretty high level of self-expressiveness to pull off the "irritated" vibe, BECAUSE it's understated. Well there's got to be something to actually understate.. 

__________________

I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student

- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)

- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male

Tap Or Click For Personal Coaching Information

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Tap Water wrote: Manwhore

Tap Water wrote:
Manwhore wrote:
Yeah most of us would be like.. well that went balls up! And we'd walk away from it. But scarcity forces a guy to pursue these situations which invariably ends up reinforcing the same bad behaviors in the first place because it causes them to chase something that isn't there, lol.

Holmes you got to work on your timidity issues. In speech/communication as well as the moves you make. Be more of a boss, lead things, sound like a boss. 

I'm now working on my timidity issues, and I'm trying to be non-apologetic about any ballzy actions I take. I like the speech/communication thing and being more of a boss in everything I do - will definitely make those second nature. I would really find it useful if I also knew the signs which signal that I am pushing it too much and need to cool off a bit.

I wouldn't worry about that for now Tap. Your problem is exactly opposite. You are so far away from rubbing a girl wrong you got nothing to worry about. It's because you were timid for so long and then all of a sudden tried to sneak in some moves that she got weirded out and came back with her friend. 

__________________

I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student

- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)

- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male

Tap Or Click For Personal Coaching Information

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Joined: 07/21/2014
Manwhore wrote: Dfusion

Manwhore wrote:
Dfusion wrote:
Tap Water wrote:
About the sub comms and if a girl talks about her ex in front of me, should I tactically change the subject to something else and every time she tries to go back to it, stop her, or what would be the best approach? I've never had a girl talk to me about her ex.

Manwhore can tell you best, but what I would do is every time she mentioned the ex, don't say anything. Literally, go quiet, don't make eye contact with her, act a bit irritated like you could could really give a shit less. If you comment back to her whenever she says something, you're just enabling her to keep saying more. If you go quiet, she'll get the idea, but you need to follow up with something that gets her mind focused on you. Do things that resonate significance. Make her remember your presence when you're with her and that will get her mind off the ex. If that's not happening, you're not doing enough. Imagine if it was situation reversed and a chick was hanging out with you and you kept bringing up the ex. If she went quiet on you and looked like she was about ready to leave every time you said something, you would get the hint.

The problem here is remember you're dealing with a timid guy. So when you tell him to go quiet and not make eye contact wit her, how do you think that's going to go? Lol. It takes a pretty high level of self-expressiveness to pull off the "irritated" vibe, BECAUSE it's understated. Well there's got to be something to actually understate.. 

Lol true! I can probably pull it off, I think I did so when she was using her phone. She's a very social media person so on the date she was taking photos and posting them up, I didn't like it so I didn't pay any attention to her and became aloof, to which she then apologised for using her phone too much and said it was just that she has wanted to go to the place we were at for a long time, then she put her phone away.

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Manwhore wrote: Tap Water

Manwhore wrote:
Tap Water wrote:
Manwhore wrote:
Yeah most of us would be like.. well that went balls up! And we'd walk away from it. But scarcity forces a guy to pursue these situations which invariably ends up reinforcing the same bad behaviors in the first place because it causes them to chase something that isn't there, lol.

Holmes you got to work on your timidity issues. In speech/communication as well as the moves you make. Be more of a boss, lead things, sound like a boss. 

I'm now working on my timidity issues, and I'm trying to be non-apologetic about any ballzy actions I take. I like the speech/communication thing and being more of a boss in everything I do - will definitely make those second nature. I would really find it useful if I also knew the signs which signal that I am pushing it too much and need to cool off a bit.

I wouldn't worry about that for now Tap. Your problem is exactly opposite. You are so far away from rubbing a girl wrong you got nothing to worry about. It's because you were timid for so long and then all of a sudden tried to sneak in some moves that she got weirded out and came back with her friend. 

You're right.. that makes a lot of sense. For most of the time I didn't escalate much physically, and then suddenly I decided to try some moves and in her room so it must of freaked her out the sudden peak in escalation. Next time I'll pace it throughout the date (if that's the correct thing to do?), and disregard thinking about whether or not I'm pushing it too much.

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Manwhore wrote: Yeah most of

Manwhore wrote:
Yeah most of us would be like.. well that went balls up! And we'd walk away from it. But scarcity forces a guy to pursue these situations which invariably ends up reinforcing the same bad behaviors in the first place because it causes them to chase something that isn't there, lol.

Holmes you got to work on your timidity issues. In speech/communication as well as the moves you make. Be more of a boss, lead things, sound like a boss. 

Wholy shiat.

__________________

“Cleverness devoid of wisdom is extremely dangerous and destructive.
Enlightenment consciously chosen means to relinquish your attachment to past and future and to make the Now the main focus of your life.  Through allowing, you become what you are: vast, spacious. You become whole. You are not a fragment anymore, which is how the ego perceives itself. Your true nature emerges, which is one with the nature of God"
- Tollester

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Manwhore wrote: I wouldn't

Manwhore wrote:
I wouldn't worry about that for now Tap. Your problem is exactly opposite. You are so far away from rubbing a girl wrong you got nothing to worry about. It's because you were timid for so long and then all of a sudden tried to sneak in some moves that she got weirded out and came back with her friend. 

This is a gigantic sticking point for tons of guys, me included. if you wait too long to be physical the entire date is fucked. I know girls who tried to make me wait like 3+ dates for sex simply because the first time I hung out with them, I wasn't physical enough and it ended up messing up the entire dynamic.

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PokemonMaster

PokemonMaster wrote:
Manwhore wrote:
I wouldn't worry about that for now Tap. Your problem is exactly opposite. You are so far away from rubbing a girl wrong you got nothing to worry about. It's because you were timid for so long and then all of a sudden tried to sneak in some moves that she got weirded out and came back with her friend. 

This is a gigantic sticking point for tons of guys, me included. if you wait too long to be physical the entire date is fucked. I know girls who tried to make me wait like 3+ dates for sex simply because the first time I hung out with them, I wasn't physical enough and it ended up messing up the entire dynamic.

Sorry for the delayed reply, I was a little busy for the past few days.

You're absolutely right about waiting too long to be physical, it totally fucks up not just the date but also takes you back a little in terms of the whole interaction you have got going with the girl. Woah, 3+ dates is quite an extension especially if she was DTF from the first date. On Sunday she will be having that dance performance she has been practising for, I am thinking of sending her an "All the best with your dance performance tonight, break a leg ;)" message to reinitiate the conversation; good or bad? Any suggestions?

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Don't think you want to tell

Don't think you want to tell a girl to break a leg during a dance performance LOL. 

I'd be like.. Damn girl didn't know you'd go to all this trouble just to impress me :p Be awesome tonight I know you will 

__________________

I go in and I'm crisp, clean and my vocals are fucking coming out like music. - Anonymous MW student

- Autismus Terminus Finis (Root Cause/Cure of Autism Epidemic)

- Called Off My Wedding & Other Turn Tail Signs Of The American Male

Tap Or Click For Personal Coaching Information

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Manwhore wrote:Don't think

Manwhore wrote:
Don't think you want to tell a girl to break a leg during a dance performance LOL. 

I'd be like.. Damn girl didn't know you'd go to all this trouble just to impress me :p Be awesome tonight I know you will 

LOL true!
Cool, I'm going to send her that message and see what happens, thanks!
Just to clarify, what trouble would I mean when I say "go to all this trouble just to impress me"?

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Manwhore wrote: Damn girl

Manwhore wrote:
Damn girl didn't know you'd go to all this trouble just to impress me :p Be awesome tonight I know you will 

lmao. fucking money.

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Manwhore wrote:Don't think

Manwhore wrote:
Don't think you want to tell a girl to break a leg during a dance performance LOL. 

I'd be like.. Damn girl didn't know you'd go to all this trouble just to impress me :p Be awesome tonight I know you will 

Dude, I don't know how you do it, but I sent her that message and she replied! Legend :D She said "Loool! Thank you :)" I don't mean to sound like a chode but now that texting has been reinitiated I want to do everything right this time and I'm ready to do all that is necessary, so what would be the best thing to say/do right now?

PS: Thanks Dfusion for the advice to wait a few weeks before texting her again, hopefully her memory of my previous incompetance has be sufficiently reduced by now.